USB connection issues

I’m using the Bartok connected to the Innuos Statement server with Roon installed. Just updated devise again tonight. An update for Mosaic. USB is connected but I can’t confirm this, at least not from the mosaic app which says nothing is found under the devise USB heading. USB is my preferred input. In the Roon app there are at least three connection options when I touch the source icon. All them are connected to the Bartok. I think it’s showing three connection options. My Roon abilities are low.
Roon shows - Air play, RAAT, both of which work, the other I think is USB which was working but at some point it switched or was switched out of USB mode. When I select that source nothing plays, none of these are labeled by connection, I have to select, play then look at the source path. I want to change that but anyway. One question is should the Bartok screen display USB when it’s locked to that input. Should the Mosaic app display something when USB is connected. Is there a way to select that input from the unit, I can’t find inputs in the menu. Is there any thing else to check before checking the cable itself. It may have been shifted but not removed from its connectors. Initial setup months ago was rather touchy. In not happy with the way the usb cable just hangs in there. That could be the problem but testing that is hard. Should I have to shut the unit down after fighting with the cable or should it just show up in the app while I test that ?

Also, the Bartok display shows NETWORK when it does play, I can’t remember if it showed USB before.

Forget that last remark

The USB menu item in Mosaic is for browsing the contents of a USB flash drive attached to the USB2 input on the rear panel of your unit. It’s not for selecting the USB1 input that your server is connected to.

The USB input can be selected using the INPUT button on the front panel. It’s the fourth button from the left and will cycle through all inputs that it can lock to. When selected the front panel will show “USB” in the upper left section of the screen.

You can also change the input via Mosaic on the Audio Settings page. Select SETTINGS (upper left corner of the app) > Audio, then tap on “Source” to be presented with a list of inputs.

For your configuration you will need to manually select the USB via the front panel, Mosaic, or using a remote control (if you have one). The input will not be automatically selected just by initiating playback in Roon.

To be perfectly honest with you the performance of Roon playback via the NETWORK input (using RAAT) is superior to USB both in terms of sound and convenience. When using Roon the network interface will always be our recommendation 100% of the time.

Ok, Should have seen those, but they are small especially the app source lettering doesn’t especially invite selecting, if you know what I mean, I forgot I could do that.
Anyway,with USB now selected on the display I still can’t get Roon to play through it. Sorry if I seem inept but my previous Dac had one input. I would like to be able to test your opinion as to sound quality, though I don’t think your familiar with, Innuos who sees the two outputs as competitive. USB was my intended input, the Statement has a very good USB output, it also has a very good dedicated bridged ethernet output to Dac but that connection is not hooked up, I believe I would have to make changes to the Statements settings to run a short ethernet cable between them. Otherwise my home network is not at all optimized for audio, and apparently RAAT is using its regular non audio ethernet input to move files through my google router over regular cable and that is not the way Innuos is designed to sound best.
So if your able to assist me with seeing if there is anything your aware of to reestablishing my USB connection for now, I would be most grateful.
For instance if the screen displays USB as it is selected, does that mean it is locked on to it ? No, if I pull the cable out the display remains the same. So I can’t really test it until Roon sees it. Any suggestions

Andrew, keep in mind that your talking to someone who doesn’t understand exactly what these designations mean. I don’t mind exploring other means of getting audio into the Bartok but what isn’t clear is how one goes about confirming which inputs are actually being used. I don’t want to assume I’m using USB or a network connection, I want to know, if I’m going to make informed decisions.
Does the RAAT appearing in Roon source window give any indication or discrimination between a network or USB connection. Or does designation apply to both. From what I’m reading it covers both.
Can I positively confirm connection type in Roon.
Do I have to look at the Bartok screen or the Mosaic app source sector to not only select but CONFIRM connection type.
If, from Roon I switch pathways will the Bartok’s screens show the change.

So if Bartok screen shows USB and music is playing and Roon pathway shows Statement - RAAT - Bartok, am I assured of USB playback ?

If you aren’t able to get the USB audio input to work first try power-cycling your Bartok from the rear panel switch and try again. If it still doesn’t work then you need to contact Innuos or your dealer for assistance. The thing about USB is that it just works as long as the upstream stuff is configured correctly.

The front panel on the bartok will show “USB” when you’re using USB. If you’re using the network input then it will either show “NETWORK” or it will show the metadata of the currently playing (or paused) track.

In Mosaic you’ll typically see album artwork and metadata when the network input is in use. If USB is in use then you’ll see a big USB icon in the area where the album artwork would normally be shown.

You would be wise to enlist the assistance of your dealer on things like this as there’s only so much that I can do here and based on your questions it sounds like some hands-on assistance is in order. Your dealer should be jumping at the chance to assist you with this. If they are not then I would like to know about it.

Now that I’ve got the USB connection back and know how to confirm it on dCS devices, I’ll label that source in Roon’s source options window as well and can begin the set up a bridged network connection directly between these two well constructed devices with help of my dealer, so I can avoid my network for the server stored files when I’m not using a streaming service, which I should really get going as well.
I appeaciate your help and your point is well taken. Unfortunately things can get a little strung out when one has three dealers, none of which are local because Kansas City dealerships have been really variable to nonexisten. Todd at The Sound Environment In Omaha sells dCS / Aurender. My impression was that Roon is not part of his expertise. But I should ask again.
I could also hit up my Innuos guy for questions. As well as Roon. It just gets kind of funny how may venders can get linked together in a mirrored hall menu dance of the digital domain.
Which is just another reason why I’m trying to purchase dCS’s used Scarlatti.
Like vinyl once set up, it just works !

Thanks, Andrew

Unfortunately, the USB port of DCS Bartok works badly with the Optical Rendu from Sonore. Sometimes you need to repeat the sequence of turning the OR and DCS devices on and off several times to be able to listen to music, in my opinion, a big mistake is that the USB port is so poorly implemented in such a good device as DCS Bartok. This can ruin your listening pleasure when the device is not working properly. I hope that the next firmware updates will improve the compatibility of the USB port with all sources. Regards Robert

Hi Andrew
Sonore technical support Has several questions for DCS becouse the difficulties I have when using Sonore OpticalRendu with DCS Bartok via USB. Here they are:
What they changed in the USB interface between this an older versions? firmware, hardware, xmos chip. what driver
they use. What Linux they have tested with. Kernel number and any patches?
Thank you very much in advance for the answers I will give to Sonore technical support. I know that you will recommend using the ethernet port I am slowly inclining towards it. However, I want to try this connection after all, although there are less and less benefits from this configuration.
Regards Robert Tota

Is MQA compatible with the USB input ? I have recently begun steaming from Tidal and Qobuz. Is there an indicator or a way to verify the full unfold ?
Since I switched back to uSB from a suboptimal ethernet input configuration from Innuos server to the Bartok, now with an updated cable, the Shunyata Sigma USB I’m really enjoying an increase in overall musical engagement. Depth detail and more saturated tonality are immediately obvious. I also recently purchased their Sigma Ethernet cable for comparison. But am waiting to compare until I can figure out how to back up my Roon metadata before reconfiguring my Innuos as a Roon core only and let Bartok take over the server’s streamer functions.
I haven’t had any more connection difficulties once I established the connection.

Maybe you are using a different file transport. I use Sonore OpticalRendu and unfortunately I often have trouble getting OR connected properly with the DAC and sometimes everything is as if connected and the music does not play. That’s why these are my questions from Sonore technical support who is trying to find the cause of my failures.
Regards Robert

I can’t be of any help to you. Although I remember that John Quick told me in an email when I asked about using a USB without a power leg that the input of the Bartok requires it to establish the connection but then this leg is auto disconnected. The Dac powers it’s own usb input after that, as he put it “ galvanically isolated. I wonder if that is affecting the Rendu ?

Hi John,
I will write to Sonore technical support about this. However, I think that they should know about such a thing. Anyway, thank you for your interest. I hope someone from DCS staff will also write and help.
Regards Robert

Nothing of note.

Per our documentation we do VERY limited testing with Linux as there are just too many variants out there. I can confirm normal function with kernel versions 4.8.15 and 4.14.63. As (I hope) the Sonore guys know the kernel version is only part of it. The specific kernel configuration is critical as there are some options which may cause issues. We do not maintain a list of known kernel configurations that are known to work or not work.

We see occasional issues with Linux devices connected via USB and in almost all of those cases the root cause was some “audiophile kernel tuning” that the manufacturer of then endpoint was doing as it was perceived to improve sound quality. In the end all that it did was reduce reliability.

We officially support USB using the dCS-supplied driver on Windows or the native support built into MacOS. Given the near-infinite number of combinations of kernel versions and configurations we simply cannot support “Linux” in a generic sense. We make sure that it functions with a typical kernel and that is the extent of what we can do.

As I’ve mentioned before we consider USB to be a legacy interface and include it for convenience. All of our development effort is focused on the network interface as that offers superior performance and convenience.

The USB interface operates as an MQA renderer only. The playback software must handle the MQA decoding stage (first unfold). If the unit is receiving a properly decoded bitstream then the MQA indicator on its front panel will illuminate.

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Hi Andrew,
thank you very much for your answer. I gave it to Sonore technical support.
because there is a newer version of the software for Sonore OpticalRendu I want to try it out yet. If version 2.8 SonicOrbiter does not help, I will just start using the ethernet input in my Bartok.
Regards Robert Tota

Sorry for the long delay Andrew. At you recommendation I have been using the network connection from my Innuos. I immediately found that connection to be subjectively brighter, and continued to listen over several months. What began as a small but noticeable difference became a slight and eventual nagging annoyance at a harsh top end that finally lead me to return to USB.
I found it to be a much more relaxed and nuanced presentation. Both cables are top of the line Shunyata.
I don’t know what you mean about the dcs being a renderer. Can you please explain in simple terms the Rossini’s USB capabilities of handing MQA. It can or cannot fully unfold or receive an unfolded file. Can Roon fully unfold the file and send it to the Dac ?
Is it possible to play fully unfolded file through the Dac ?

Much appreciated,

  • John