Understand that Phil, but it’s interesting nontheless. Anyway I’ve just realized the download I referenced is only the first 21 pages … so disappointing!
Now then, have we all kissed and made up?
Fedex Have just delivered my BJC Cat 5e, together with the test report…and bang on time!
What can I say? It works!
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It went from boil to simmer a while ago now, Phil.
Blue, you do know that’s the worse colour for sound quality.
Lol, obviously only having a laugh
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I have you down as an inky black cable kinda guy, Dunc.
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Well Dunc, I did pause a bit when I added it to my basket, as my rack ‘will be’ black, the SIA-025 ‘will be’ black, my Bartók is black!
Blue Jeans Cable..it just had to be blue! Yes I know, you can get black jeans.
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I just noticed an article about expensive hi-fi in the current Financial Times (I think the author has visited KJ West One). The whole article is rather ambivalent, but has an opening sentence that speaks to the topic of this thread:
For most people, “Do I own the world’s best Ethernet cable?” is probably not a big worry.
Perfect!
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Yes, It’s a relatively expensive book to purchase, but it’s an excellent College/Postgrad-level EE reference on the subject.
To that point though, as Gregg discovered, some of the AI LLMs are clearly trained with contents from this book (which raises serious legal and ethical questions of course, but for now appears to come under “fair use” rights).
The upshot is that if you know what to ask - a bit of a catch-22 - these LLMs can provide practical insights based directly on fundamental outlined in the book.
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On a prior post, @AndrewS or @Phil (I can’t remember who, apologies!) directed another forum member to the dCS Guide To Streaming, which I had never read, and I found to have an excellent description of some of the points raised on this thread.
Section 2 is of particular interest, including this explanation:
“There is a provision built into the Ethernet specification (the specification that determines how the Ethernet port on a dCS product works), as well as any Ethernet port on any device like switches, routers or streamers & servers work, which says every Ethernet port must have galvanic isolation. This means the input of the port must be electrically isolated from the rest of the product it is feeding. This can be done in a few ways, but the most common method with standard Ethernet ports is to use a coupling transformer. This component isolates the port – meaning there is no direct electrical link between port and product – whilst allowing data to pass through unaffected.”
This is the link:
dCS Guide to Streaming – dCS Support https://share.google/3jw0QIkVA2RTJ9Ox5
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Wow - after listening to Anup go on and on about this, I guess……he knows what he is talking about
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There might need to be a section on Ethernet cable shielding? 
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Yep, it’s a fact, an actual by-design fact.
However, if we infer that galvanic isolation of “any Ethernet port on any device like switches, routers or streamers & servers“ is total, then we imply that no router, switch or cable upstream of any streamer can possibly make any difference to sound quality. That Cat 5 will always sound as good as Cat 8, not to mention as good as any other Ethernet cable or any other audio-optimised network cable. That switches, whether audio-optimised or not, installed to improve sound quality rather than as as port replicators, cannot possibly make any difference to sound quality. That optical (fiber) links upstream of any streamer cannot possibly make any difference to sound quality. In short that any network changes upstream of any streamer cannot, by design, make any difference to sound quality because the galvanic isolation of any streamer will deal with any noise presented to it.
This is technically and audibly nonsense!
Well, some of us believe the above mentioned items do not make any difference to the sound quality - and we are entitled to that belief. It is not “technically and audibly nonsense!”.
The same goes for those who are happy embarking down the above mentioned path, are happy with their findings, and want to discuss this on the forum.
Back in the day I fooled around with optimized switches, up spec ethernet cables, and optical fiber. One by one they all dropped by the wayside and I am down to a basic Cisco switch (even my posh 2960’s went away), no more fibre etc.
Speaking of fibre, I continue to keep my eye on the Linn forum as I have had (and still do) their Klimax DS streamer since 2011 (of course upgraded along the way). The next generation Klimax DS implemented fibre on the back of the unit. Most on the Linn forum do not even bother using this option. Most also use a good old bog standard ethernet cable. Just like dCS, Linn systems official recommendation is to use a bog standard compliant ethernet cable.
Interestingly enough dCS had the opportunity to implement a fibre connection while developing the Varese. Last I looked I still cannot find it
Your company manufactures and sells some of the above mentioned devices. In the nicest way possible, and truly and sincerely not meaning any disrespect what so ever, perhaps your comments on a subject which is directly related to the type of products you sell, may tread a slippery slope. I do not wish to comment on the rules of this forum, however, as a 25 year member of the Naim forum, I completely understand why they have EXTREMELY strict and binding rules on what industry people can write and discuss on their forum.
Once again, no ill will or disrespect intended. My final comment simply illustrates how other forums treat the contributions of industry members to the discussions.
Now - time to fire up the old Apex V and listen to some music
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I feel like both sides have heard each other on this matter, and everyone is of course free to choose the equipment/kit that suits their taste.
In support of the standard “spec” Ethernet group, I repost Andrew P.’s prior post on this matter. Andrew P. (not @AndrewS) was previously one of dCS’s network engineers:
>>>
“I use an Amazon Special CAT6 (I believe the brand is either Cables 2 Go or Cables Matter) between my Vivaldi Upsampler and Ubiquiti switch.
I have a unique position in the industry as the “network streaming guy” for one of the premier digital audio manufacturers so I could easily have any audiophile cable currently available. I still chose the basic unshielded cable that passed certification.
Keywords above are **unshielded** and **passed certification**.”
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an entirey understandable decision. You really wouldn’t want the noise generated by the back conversion from optical to electrical inside such a high quality device!
It’s absolutely true that fiber cannot carry conducted RFI noise, but we always need to consider the wider picture here.
I’m obviously aware of this. I have been a dCS owner and fanboy for 10 times as long as I’ve been in the audio business. I write as a dCS owner; I am not here to sell! This thread is as good evidence as several previous incarnations that the forum would be fallow hunting ground, yet I’m still here, politely countering some views which I consider to be as plain wrong as you do mine.
The important thing is perhaps to remind ourselves what came first: that you and I are both here because of our love and respect for our dCS devices. That is common ground and common ground should be celebrated.
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Nice sleuthing Richard. I very much remember that post by Andrew P.
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So far in this thread, other than claiming that I’m wrong and diss’ing other’s posts, you’ve not provided a single technical explanation of how you believe things work.
In your view, why is grounding the Ethernet Cable shield on one end only beneficial? Why are Ethernet coupling transformers “technically… nonsense”? Please provide a technical explanation, no need for a subjective opinion since we already know yours.
Does this include not soliciting dcs.community users through private message to try Rieki gear?
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You are being disingenuous by misquoting. The transformers are not nonsense, they’re integral to stuff working. I said “That optical (fiber) links upstream of any streamer cannot possibly make any difference to sound quality. In short that any network changes upstream of any streamer cannot, by design, make any difference to sound quality because the galvanic isolation of any streamer will deal with any noise presented to it.
This is technically and audibly nonsense!”
Hope this helps.
Yes. Now stop.