Question for the collective wisdom and high IQ here:
I purchased a new Bartok about a year ago and ordered an Apex upgrade for $4500. I also purchased a pair of Wilson SabrinaX.
Which of these two choices would you go with to complete your system given budget constraints?
Option 1: go with the Bartok apex upgrade and with about $8K remaining buy a Luxman 509x.
Or …
Option 2: trade in the Bartok for about $12K credit towards a D’Agostino progression integrated amp and find a DAC for about $5K until I save for a while and perhaps buy a Rossini?
I have been stuck on this decision for a little while so I thought I would ask for your help. Very much appreciated!
Or…
Option 3, get the Apex upgrade and a pair of REL subs to augment the bottom end of those otherwise fantastic SabrinaX.
Watchdog507
(Bob, Member Of The Trade, Watchdog Digital & Audio Solutions)
5
I recently attended a Wilson/D’Agostino presentation with Peter McGrath from Wilson. We listened to Wilson XVX’s powered by D’Ag Momentum mono’s with MSB DAC’s. The other presentation in another room was a Progression Integrated with a DAC module from D’Agostino. It sounded extremely good. This could be a solution if you chose D’Agostino. The module was about $8k Canadian.
Tough question. Bartok to apex is a good step but if your baseline amp is so so i think amp upgrade is more important didn’t see what your baseline amp is. Stepping down from a bartok i wouldn’t do unless it was for a short period of time
I wouldn’t take the DAC component backwards if you’re currently happy with it.
If financially viable, I think I’d save until I can afford the amp I really want and keep the Bartok in the meantime. Then save until I can afford a (possibly) used Rossini Apex and sell the Bartok.
If this isn’t an option, then I’d upgrade to the Bartok Apex for the next step forward (while you’re still able to get the upgrade at the reduced price), then save for the amp you want.
The Luxman L-509x is a mighty fine amp! But I run mine with Harbeths. Pairs beautifully with the Bartok.
The Bartok is still a great DAC without the upgrade. I’d suggest keeping it and focusing in the gaps in your system, which sounds like it’s the amplifier (or integrated).
My dealer carries Luxman and Wilson, maybe yours does too. Check it out if they do.
I would not trade the Bartok for a lesser or different DAC if you like the Bartok. You have it, keep it for now.
To me the source is the most important, but everything should be balanced. You have got a pretty fine set woth the Bartok and the Sabrina, it would be a pity to sell anyone of them for something less performing, just in exchange for a great amp…
Could you just wait and save a lirtle bit more ?
I wouldn’t touch the DAC either and instead of getting an integrated, I would save up for power amplifier. And when budget permits again, would go for a decent preamplifier, if not a passive one, most probably from iCon passive preamplifier.
Ah, in that case, I’d probably go with your first option and upgrade the amp at a later point in time (assuming you’ve listened to this amp and are happy with its performance).
I think the Bartok is worth keeping and upgrading to Apex, given the pricing you have for the latter. It is a fantastic DAC and I think anything else would likely be a step backwards.
One thing to point out – $4500 for the Bartok APEX upgrade is an easy decision (when you are ready). This is another argument in favor of keeping the Bartok.
Some of us have to pay a lot more than that for it, complicating the decision. For example, the total cost of the APEX upgrade (including shipping and taxes) can exceed the cost of a brand new Luxman L509x! Puts things into perspective.
Do you have a plan/long term goal for your system and overall budget? I find it saves money and hassle if you know where you’re headed long term. It strikes me that with the level of speaker you own something along the lines of Rossini Apex + Clock into a Dan Progression would be a balanced destination. Very similar to where I’m headed.
In your shoes I’d keep the Bartok as is and buy a used Luxman integrated (other makes of amp are available ), save up and trade the Bartok for a Rossini Apex then trade the Luxman in for the Progression.
I’m just back from demoing/ordering kit at my dealer, in particular I wanted a good listen to the Progression. My kit before the visit was Bartok non Apex / Luxman 590AXII / Logan 11a. After the visit I had traded Bartok for Rossini Apex + Clock which is now playing and agreed to trade the Logan 11a for 15a today. Your Sabrina X speakers were very close to being chosen after a previous head to head with the 11a but the electrostatic sound won out in the end and I went with the 15a.
Have to say I wasn’t blown away with the Progression, which wasn’t what I expected to be writing, but I will have another dealer demo and then proper home demo if I don’t hear anything in the shop I like better. Won’t know until I head to head at home against my Luxman if the Progression is the right choice, has a preferred presentation.
My Bartok was old so the price to upgrade too steep in my view, the Bartok Apex was definitely better but not by enough to make me want to stump up the dosh. The Rossini Apex is a big improvement imho. I did have a chance to compare the various units at home against my own Bartok non Apex - a Bartok Apex, a Rossini non Apex and then a Rossini Apex (all via my mate Omni on here, who kindly loaned each of them to me for a decent amount of time - top bloke).
Its a relief for me to read that other Audiophiles enjoy electrostatics. I too really rate my Martin Logan 15a 's with the Rossini and Roon. Perhaps unusually I opted to stay with Chord Electronics for amplification choosing the Chord Ultima Pre 2 and Chord Ultima 3 Monoblocks; but I wonder as I write this if I really need 480W to drive these active speakers?
@GusGus Care to expand upon that? I am looking to arrange a demo with Momentum Stereo S250MxV amp to use with my Rossini APEX/Clock. Current system for the past 20+ years has been a Naim 500 system. Eliminating the Naim preamp and going direct to the Naim amp has been an eye opener. It is time to have a look at alternatives.
@T38.45 - GORGEOUS! I would love to hear some comments on this pairing as well. Most likely you are using a Nagra amp as well?
