As mentioned Andrew says that v 1.1.1 is imminent so let’s see what we get.
DOS? That was my first experience of using a computer. Using it to write something and having to send a command to " add another line" !! Then using early internet with no proper graphics and connections so slow that you could watch a screen build line by line. How far we have come in what is really a comparatively short time.
Just adding another note to this and going back to the original post. I’ve discovered that sending the stream as WAV to the Bartok seems to cause less delay. This would kind of make sense since the Bartok needs to get a header of data before it can start to process the conversion of the flac format files that I would normally use. Still experimenting.
What is “fundamentally flawed” in gapless UPnP playback? I enjoy UPnP gapless playback since years and never occurred to me to find anything flawed (let apart “fundamentally” flawed) with it. On the contrary, gapless replay works flawlessly.
Thanks for clarifying that dCS products are essentially unusable with 3rd party control apps! This is very sad but at least I know that I do not want to demo a dCS product any longer.
I have to say that, at a first glance, I prefer the Mosaic’s presentation to the BubbleUPnP one. I consider BubbleUPnP to be the best control point that I have used so far and I use it every day. But I never use anything else than list views. The big tiles would drive me crazy! That said, a good control point should support different views and customization options. Also, I am shocked about the lack of support for gapless replay. I thought that dCS were serious about classical music, opera and … interoperability but this is obviously not the case. Too bad, I really would have liked to demo a Network Bridge at a certain point!
Of course Mosaic does support gapless replay. I use it every day. However dCS does not support certain third party implementations of UPnP for reasons explained in the FAQs. MInimServer is what is supported for those same reasons.
Mosaic is a work in progress and is subject to change in the future. The next version is expected shortly. Whilst I doubt that Bubble will be supported it is possible that some of the GUI features that you want may be catered for. We will not know until it is released.
However as you are clearly emotionally tied to Bubble then a product that supports it would accordingly seem to be be more suitable for you even if you;
Which seems paradoxical.
I do not see anything paradoxical in what I wrote: I prefer list views to tiled views. Consequently, I always use list views in BubbleUPnP. What is paradoxical in this?
The fact that dCS devices support gapless replay only with a control point that is, as you write, “work in progress” does suggest neither very usable products nor particular customer care, I am afraid.
But wouldn’t you love to own a dCS product nonetheless, because they sound fantastic! 
I don’t speak for dCS, but since Andrew hasn’t replied, I thought I might add my 2cents FWIW.
I wouldn’t personally call it “flawed”, but Andrew’s not entirely wrong about UPnP and gapless playback; the UPnP specification as it stands even today, does not have a framework for gapless audio rendering at its most basic level.
Playback controls and states are presumed to be single-track and time-bound in the specifications for “AVTransport” - which defines the transport control interface - the list of controls for “Play()” and “CurrentPlayMode” do not include continuous gapless playback.
What the UPnP specification does have though, is an optional control; “SetNextAVTransportURI” (and it’s corresponding “NextAVTransportURI”) which in combination tells a Renderer what track to pre-load next for a more “seamless” transition between tracks. But since it’s only an optional control (not “[R]equired” within the UPnP specification), the exact implementation is left entirely to individual manufacturers of specific Renderer/Control-point/Server. Even when its properly implemented on a particular Renderer, there’s no guarantee that gapless playback would work properly with any random DLNA/UPnP Server, and Control-Point software.
So you have all these hardware/software dependencies because the UPnP specification is weak (not to mention the dog’s breakfast that UPnP+ is 
)
I certainly would love to own a dCS product and I would have already demoed a Network Bridge if it wasn’t so difficult to find a dealer in Berlin.
However, I would not buy a device that only supports gapless replay when used in conjunction with a specific, proprietary control point. Especially if the control point was “work in progress”.
I have seen many examples of great hardware and great sound quality compromised by poor software solutions and sluggish software support.
There are also examples of manufacturers that manage to deliver great sound quality without compromising usability and interoperability.
Thus, there is no reason to give up usability or to accept compromises in interoperability!
Ok, can you name one then? A high-end Ethernet Streamer/DAC manufacturer (of roughly comparable sound quality with dCS) whose platform works with an “open” UPnP Control-point software to control their most-often used hardware features like Volume control, input selection, filter selection, balance control, Phase inversion, etc. in addition to gapless playback?
Well I’m 99% sure the NAIM products do. Okay you can’t adjust Phase Inversion or balance but, honestly, how often do you want to do these functions anyway? However the NAIM app has better gui and operation and works correctly with just about any upnp server.
If dCS asked me the question whether I would prefer them to
I would definitely ask for the first path. In a defined ecosystems you stand a chance of making things work as they are intended to. When you open up the scope and introduce a large number of elements that are not under your control, the results are highly unpredictable. It may work in some circumstances (i.e. for BubbleUPnP and gapless playback) and it may not work for other combinations or features. For every problem you fix, customers are likely to discover another one that will absorb development resources.
Someone else may prefer a different path. I for one am very happy with the way dCS are approaching this issue.
Ironically, I actually complained myself to dCS about the lack of gapless playback with BubbleUPnP back in the Rossini 1.0 days, but that complaint resolved itself with the introduction of Rossini 2.0 and Mosaic.
Very happy camper now.
Steve, you might have misunderstood my point, the Naim App is also a proprietary Control App that only works with Naim, just like Mosaic/dCS;
@nbpf is arguing for a non-proprietary (“open”) UPnP Control-point to work with dCS for gapless, and presumably control all the other often used dCS features as well.
The point I was trying to drive at is that no such thing exist in the real world, from any manufacturer, especially in the high-end arena where vendors are trying to drive value and differentiation, not go down to the “lowest common denominator” (which is what an “open” or “universal” Control-point gets you).
I mean that NAIM products seem to support gapless with control apps OTHER than the NAIM app. But, as I say, on the other hand, the NAIM app itself is better because of a more intuitive design AND it works with other UPnP servers. So I’m making two points: 1. it supports gapless with 3rd party control apps AND 2. the ‘house’ app supports all (well I only ever tried 3 or 4 tbh) UPnP servers rather than just a single package.
Right, got what you mean! 
. Are there any Naim users who don’t use the Naim App? Presumably they’ll need to juggle multiple apps just control playback then.
By the way, I did a quick google search, looks like Naim also contracts StreamUnlimited for their NP800 board. So, it’s really all just down to the UPnP stack on the streaming board then .
tbh the main reason for my using bubble was because the dcs app is VERY tied into minim and, tbh, I don’t like minim. It’s hard to use and lacking on features. I use/prefer asset which is super easy and does things like ‘new albums’ and ‘jukebox album’ but asset doesn’t work with the Bartok. I keep on seeing promises of a ‘better’ minim but nothing ever happens. I’ve paid for the later version but that does nothing more than the original product!
Not sure why they would need to juggle apps? Do you mean to change source? Yes but most people only ever use one stream source.
I understand that dcs use stream unlimited but, some time ago (2017), took over development of this platform.
Steve, I just gave Asset (Release 7.1-Beta 3) a quick spin on one of my Synology NAS. Seems to work just fine with Mosaic and Bartok!
Tested a couple of basic things, like browsing and playing tracks by [Artist], and by [Album], as well as the [Jukebox Tracks Selection], and a couple of DSD128 tracks. No apparent issue at all.
What exactly doesn’t work for you?
Couple of screenshots for you;
Play an album and it plays in alphabetical order rather than track order.
Well, all my rips are properly numbered, either with “Number-Track_name” or “Number. Track_name”, and Mosaic/Asset properly lists them correctly, and intelligently strips the numbering off when listing and playback.
Aren’t your rips the same??
(I just double checked them on some random albums in-case I was missing the obvious);
This is excellent news! I’ll try it right now.
I tried with the first vr7 beta and it was still playing alphabetically. However it looks like this has been sorted in one of the later version releases which is very good news indeed. tbh I never considered that it might have been sorted in a later release and didn’t test again.
This does fix a lot of my issues with mosaic. tbh the screen layout for mosaic is still, IMHO, not great but let’s see what the forthcoming release has to offer.
Thanks for testing this and kicking me to give it another try.
Yep… just tried it and the asset compatibility issue is sorted 
You are missing my point: I haven’t written about volume control, filter selection, balance control, phase inversion, etc.
I have argued that there are manufacturers that deliver sound quality and gapless replay via generic control points: Sonore, Bryston, Linn are example. One can control these devices with, among others, BubbleUPnP, Linn Kazoo and Lumin app without having to give up gapless replay.
