Bartok: to Apex or not to Apex?

Guess who’s back home, fully grownup now…


:grin:

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Congrats!!

Woohoo!!! :raised_hands:

You’ll love it.

I already do!

First impression?

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Tremendous!

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Listening notes or it didn’t happen. :wink:

Well, how to describe what has already been said by many others?
Just after a tenth of hours listening to my favorite records, the APEX version is “better on everything”:

  • (obviously) better Signal to Noise Ratio. The sound naturally comes out of nothing with a total transparency, as if it was somewhat artificially forced before with the non APEX version

  • Separation between instruments and micro details: until a few years ago, I was very happy with instrument separation consisting in hearing a void between guitar, cello, voice… Since Bartok 2.0, I was able to hear not a void anymore, but kind of the sound of the stage/room/studio that got captured during the recording. With the APEX, this sound becomes cristal clear, you hear attacks, decays, echoes, sound bouncing from a wall to the other that you just never heard before! Quite addictive, with the thinking of “how could I have never heard that before ?”

  • Body & Incarnation: there’s just more “meat to the bone”! Every captured sound now has a heavier weight that makes it even “more believable” and that can be perceived as an evidence. The music as you should always have heard and listened to it…

Now, a (big) caveat:
On my side, I’m part of the happy fews who bought their Bartoks shortly after the product was released and was still in the 10-14k price range. For those like me looking for a sound upgrade, it’s kind of a no brainer (even though ~10k still is a lot of money).
Now for the people who bought their non APEX Bartok after the price increased at 20k, is it worth the price to add 10k more?
Despite all the major improvements I can hear, paying 30k overall for a Bartok is too much money IMHO. I would be really hesitant to upgrade and be bitter at dCS…
A Rossini is “just” 5k more at 35k, the dCS competitors in the 15-30k range progress quite fast as well (Grimm Audio, Rockna, Bricasti, Denafrips… among many others).

(Edit) Addendum:
Using headphones, although an improvement is there, the gap between the non-APEX and APEX version isn’t as outstanding as with Loudspeakers.

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That sounds a reasonable opinion. However a brand new Bartok Apex is 19K gbp ( including VAT) and its predecessor was also considerably less in its home country. So you could or “should” have bought a new Bartok Apex for around €22.5K. However the Apex upgrade is the same for Vivaldi, Rossini or Bartok. So the additional cost is a higher percentage of the original price as you go lower in the range. A point that I have made in these columns in the past.

That kind of thing is true for all components in all audio sectors. It’s called competition.There is or was also nothing to prevent you buying one of those instead. However you didn’t so I presume you had reasons to decide not to.

That’s an inherent issue with headphones. Things like headphone transfer function need solutions which have not been solved ( or frankly, even addressed in the main. An exception is , or was, the Smyth Realiser).

Your listening notes are made at an early stage and things will improve further over the next few weeks. BTW, how was the music?

Add the Linn Klimax DS to that list as well - and no additional clock required

Here is what I wrote on the TAS Facebook page on the Apex upgrade:

Based on my listening, the standout characteristics of the Rossini
APEX with Rossini master clock are as follows:
• New levels of resolution
• A truly effortless midrange
• World-class bass and vocals
• Deep and wide soundstage
• Even better dynamics

dCS claim a 12db increase in linearity with the new boards in the
APEX hardware. Has accuracy now converged to create strong
musical involvement? Is accuracy no longer the enemy of
involvement? I suspect the answer is a resounding Yes to both
questions. Indeed, maybe the accuracy of the Ring DAC is the key
aspect of musical involvement.

Even well-mastered 16/44 tracks sounded absolutely stunning and
not too far, I am surprised to say, a 24/96 version. I believe that gap
narrows quite a bit on state-of-the-art DACs.

Look, I love vinyl records even more than most audiophiles but
damn…digital this good with the convenience of a Roon or Mosaic
interface and a huge streaming library is forcing me to re-arrange
my thinking on digital. I can only imagine what the Vivaldi APEX is
capable of. As for the Rossini APEX, it really feels like it may have
equaled or surpassed the non-APEX Vivaldi. That’s a very nice
neighborhood to play in. I placed an order to upgrade my Rossini to
APEX level. And that’s perhaps the best news of this whole
exercise: dCS has a senior technician near Boston who will replace
the boards and back plate stateside for the upgrade fee.

Again, many thanks to Alan Jones and hifibuys for setting the
listening session up for me, and for John Giolas at dCS explaining
the new technology and upgrade program over several calls and
texts. The bottom line for me is that the Rossini APEX is at a whole
new level of sound. It’s worth the trip to your dealer. It’s just that
simple.

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One more caveat: heat / power consumption.
When in standby the non APEX version stopped heating and its internal temperature was kept in the 25-28°C range.
I was surprised to pass the hand over the Bartok chassis yesterday and to notice it was still quite warm while in standby for a couple of hours! Looking at the “Status” under Mosaic menu: 40°C!
Ok, so the standby only turns off the display and dCS logo as of now, keeping the circuitry always warm and ready for action… :confused:

Probably not exceptional but I am tagging @Phil in he has anything to add. The internal temperature will also partly depend upon the environment’s ambient one which will also affect your perception of warmth when touching the unit. Actually 25-28C seems a bit low as all of the dCS DACs I have owned typically operated at over 30C. My Vivaldi DAC operates at circa 39.2-39.7 C and standby is not markedly dissimilar, if this helps. Remember that the Apex board is the same for all models.

That will not have charged with the Apex update which has nothing to do with system operation. The whole point of standby is to maintain internal temperature so as to enable immediate use upon demand. So, from a green viewpoint ,the standby option doesn’t add much IMO aside from saving wear of the display. This is fine if listening sessions are reasonably close together but if , like me, they are usually several days apart it is arguable that a switch off from the front panel may be preferable as that is the only way of reducing power consumption significantly without full system power off using the rocker switch. See the power consumption specifications in the user manual which, perhaps significantly, does not give a figure for standby. However Apex power consumption may have changed from the original unit but that may require dCS comment.

Thanks Pete.
Actually, I now doubt regarding your message and may actually be wrong.
I now recall my Bartok when it was not APEXed to be warm to the touch sometimes even in standby, but rather in summer…
Therefor, let’s not consider my previous post, at least for now…

Just chiming in to share how much joy the Bartok APEX brings me every time I listen to it. This device is perhaps the best component I’ve ever owned in terms of musical satisfaction. And today, here in the USA, it’s soothing my anxious nerves.

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