If the Music is lifeless with thé Rossini, than you have a problem somewhere…
He says that they appear lifeless, not in an absolute manner, but when compared to the vinyl.
Remember that digital remasters of 1950/60 analogue originals can leave a lot to be desired especially as some of the original tapes have degraded before conversion.
My wall to ears:
- DIY power strip with solid copper rails and hospital-grade connectors
- 10G Optical-Ethernet converter to Rossini with an IsoCAT Ethernet filter (mini+Roon on network)
- dCS Rossini DAC + dCS Rossini Clock, clock cables are 50cm Cardas Parsecs (BNC terminated), power cables are Shunyata Venom (both DAC and Clock)
- Kondo Ls-41 1.5m interconnect (silver)
- Audio Note Kondo Ongaku amp, Kondo Avocado power cord, Kondo KSL-SPz speaker cables
- Avantgarde Acoustic Duo Mezzo speaker
- Air
- Room
- Ears
Don’t get me wrong - Rossini sounds amazing and I truly enjoy the music out of it. But there’s something else about vinyl (other than it is a pain in the ass to deal with).
My SME setup does sound truly amazing. But TBH, that’s $45k worth of vinyl gear, actually about the same as Rossini+Clock+Interconnect (the interconnect makes a huge diff).
I had a similar vinyl set up - SME 20/3 with Lyra Titan into Halcro DM10 ( a very good phono pre). To my ears my Rossini + clock is a superior source. Over the years I have become tired of the faff and anxieties of vinyl. We all have different ears and preferences.
1 Like
You have an incredible system that most would/are be envious of Miguel. That amplifier! : )
Re: the comment on vinyl versus digital, I am deliberately asking the controversial and rhetorical question: Where will that gap be in 2 years? In 5 years, as the “classics” are increasing re-recorded by new “masters”–e.g. Daniil Trifonof–in native HD and DSD?
Similarly, all of the dynamics of the digital realm are subject to high speed innovation and cost compression cycles. Maintaining the analogue equipment as the consumer market/world becomes more and more digital will get even more expensive.
My personal opinion is that vinyl can provide incredible results now, at great cost, but will soon go the way of VHS. It’s just an opinion and no offense to anyone.
It’s been several years since I’ve had the HD 800S, so I can’t accurately compare both. But the Susvara is the best headphone I’ve heard, for the music I listen to most. The Susvara is incredibly detailed but at the same time so natural and musical, especially with voices and acoustic music.
For rock and electronic the Abyss Phi TC is unbeatable though - so I have both the TC and Susvara.
Both are quite power-hungry though - especially the Susvara. I can power the Susvara just fine from my Luxman P-750u headphone amp, but it really sings when connected to the speaker taps of my Gryphon integrated amp!
2 Likes
THIS is the most important point here… But for a different reason.
I the last 2-3 years there has been a tidal wave of new DACs that are spelling a leap in sound reproduction. It might not be that easy to see, but DACs like the Denafrips Terminator or Holo Audio May are really transforming what a DAC in the in the $6k price range can do. I have not listened to them, but know a bunch of knowledgeable people who are seeing a transformation.
It used to be that making a high performing R2R DAC was very expensive. Today you can use automation and lasers to produce resistors with incredibly tight tolerances and build R2R DACs as performing as what only the likes of MSB could build in the past. I am actually humbled by all this evolution. Same is true for other technologies like precise clocking.
Check out the reviews of the Holo Audio Spring 3. Look at the innards of that device, how carefully it’s been designed and executed. It is stunning that they are able to produce this level of design and quality at that price point, but what is even more stunning to me is the level of EVOLUTION and change towards what sounds good. No stone is left unturned.
I am honestly not very hopeful for the likes of dCS or MSB. I don’t see much evolution at all in the products they produce. When I see the lightning speed of evolution of these other companies, I start to question how these storied firms will survive.
I am actually considering purchasing one of these other products and having them for some time and see what my conclusion is. Hell, I just got an interconnect for my Rossini that is more expensive than any of these alternatives.
It is a time of change. And I think overall it is for the better for digital audio reproduction. Who will survive? I don’t think I am putting my chips on the big guys. They are just too slow.
4 Likes
@miguelito
Very astute comments. A friend and I have been talking about the May for quite a while.
Which Roon ready streamer would you use for it? IMHO it should be price appropriate commensurate with the $4-$5k price of the DAC so something around the $2k range. This would rule out an Inuos product IMHO.
Why? A 1TB Innuos Zen Mini Mk3 is 1049 gbp here .However that price includes 20% VAT. So the product price is 839 gbp or $1136. Of course that doesn’t mean that the US distributor wants to sell it to you for that!
It is right that less expensive DACs have narrowed the gap with the ultra high end brands. However you need to ensure that the comparison is strictly like for like and that connectivity, flexibility and future support are also accounted for.
It is also the case that many of these new DACS are made in low wage countries and are sold directly. I prefer to support decent wages and have local support if it goes wrong.
1 Like
Local service - especially if a component fails- is a must have for me. As my roon server broke down I called the dealer, he picked it up and cared about the service. I will never buy an expensive unit over the web again…
Well…what you call the big guys are not that big. It is small companies, and they have the necessary agility to innovate…if they want to.
But it is right to say that they cannot do many strategic mistakes. Sometimes only one or two mistakes and the company is gone…
A long while back I started using a microRendu to make my DAC at the time be RoonReady. This is a little box that takes Ethernet in and has a USB port to which you connect the DAC. It is designed and executed very carefully and sounds great. Aside from RoonReady, it can do Spotify Connect, Airplay, and most importantly HQPlayer’s NAA.
There’s a newer version of this box that can take optical in (from an optical ethernet, great for isolation) and has the customary USB port for the DAC. It comes in two versions: one with JUST RoonReady, and one with all of what I mentioned ($1k and $1.5k respectively last time I checked). This would be something I would consider for this.
There are other options. For example, if you are in the market for a Roon core - or might consider it in the light of all of these changes - you could get a Nucleus and connect it over USB to the DAC.
The Innuos is interesting - I thought it was more expensive - but honestly I don’t care for a CD drive (rip on my main computer) or a server per-se that is not Roon, so it’s a product that ticks many boxes just very few of my boxes.
Ok true, I meant reputationally and price point wise. the Ring DAC has not been updated in what, 10 yrs? The MSB DAC modules about the same? This is what I mean. The Vivaldi v2 is easily 5 yrs old. There are bugs with Rossini that have not been fixed in years. These are the things I think are amiss.
For the record, dCS has generally provided good support in the past, and I understand the ongoing cost of development, so I have NO problem with price increases. But the support has been waning as of late.
That is important. But the reality of the market is different. People will overwhelmingly choose the better products. If the high end guys don’t keep up, they will be out of work soon.
2 Likes
@miguelito & @PAR
Thank you for the replies. I am already familiar with both Zen and Sonore solutions and was just curious if there were alternatives which may have escaped me.
My only “concern” with both the Holo and Denafrips are their use of USB inputs. I consider this input inherently flawed and much prefer the Ethernet input I currently use on both my Rossini and Linn Klimax DS. I also prefer the fact that both have internal streamers - less additional boxes and cables to deal with.
Best
Gregg
There are a number of other solutions. For example the Soundaware d300ref (that’s $4k) that can be clocked from the Terminator+ clock outputs and output over I2S or the various versions of SPDIF.
However, I would rethink your USB prejudices to be honest. The Spring 3 has a very carefully designed USB input with full galvanic isolation, including an optical bridge for signal (better than transformers) and full ground isolation (not always done properly). I was looking at this yesterday and was amazed.
What I should’ve said was the 2 Redbook CD album rips through my Rossini sounds a bit lifeless compared to the same vinyl albums. My point wasn’t to denigrate the Rossini but merely to point out that digital still has a ways to go.
On my former Bartok, only PCM filter was displayed (when playing PCM and upsampling set to DSD).
On the Vivaldi One I’m currently testing, it works the opposite. Only DSD filter is displayed.
User’s manual says that PCM filter is the one to be displayed.
Am I the only one that gets DSD filter displayed and not the PCM one?
It might be worthwhile posting your question in a new thread as it is a little off topic for this one ( not that it isn’t diversifying quite a bit anyway). Not everyone is interested in every thread so otherwise your question may not be read by those having an answer.